How this card was used in the anime compared to its real life effect
It was stated in the Yu-Gi-Oh! GX - Episode 118 page that Snake Whistle can only activate when a Reptile-type monster is destroyed by a card effect. It can't activate when the monster is destroyed by battle since that would miss the timing (This happens if the lore says "when" it happens but it would not if the lore said "if" it happens). Viper activated this card when his Venom Snake was destroyed by Jaden's Plasma Vice in battle, but this could not be possible in the real game since Snake Whistle only activates "when" a Reptile-type monster is destroyed by a card effect. It can't be activated if the Reptile monster is destroyed in battle. Cardsknower (talk • contribs) 23:58, July 23, 2011 (UTC)Cardsknower
- In future reference, if you're post a comment in Forum or Talk Page, be sure to type down four tildes at end of your freaking comments before you slam up the Publish Button, ok? As for Anime/TCG difference, Anime can break the game no matter what your objection is for; like "Monster Reborn" during your opponent's turn on Battle Phase - Yami Yugi pulled it out of his ass to stop Marik's attack at Yu-Gi-Oh! - Episode 141, so it's possible for Snake Whistle to activate even though it's timing was not correct at that time. --FredCat 23:47, July 23, 2011 (UTC)
I am sorry for forgetting to sign that earlier comment (because I can forgets things sometimes) but it is true that you can't activate Snake Whistle unless the monster is destroyed by a card effect. The effect lore should be different in the anime compared to the real effect. And that thing about Monster Reborn happened in the second series anime, and a lot of things changed by GX. If a card effect misses the timing in any series past the second series anime, then the effect had to be different than the real life counterpart, so I don't see why you keep deleting that since this card was not played in the second series anime since the rules there are different compared to the rules in the TCG.Cardsknower (talk • contribs) 23:58, July 23, 2011 (UTC) Cardsknower
- 'Timing' isn't really what this is called; so changing it from 'when' to 'if' doesn't mean anything.
- Some cards which can activate in the Damage Step in the TCG have the same wording as cards which cannot activate in the Damage Step; with only the rulings to differentiate between them.
- What would make a difference, and would make it clear is changing it to something like "destroyed (either by battle or by card effect)"; but that's probably not what the card actually says in the anime.
- Did GX-JP have lores on the cards back then? so they can be translated directly?
- -Falzar FZ- (talk page|useful stuff) 23:59, July 23, 2011 (UTC)
Actually it does mean something, because I read the missing the timing page and I read that if the lore has an optional effect that says "when" a condition occurs, then the activation condition has to be the last that happens. If something else occurs after the activation condition was met, then the timing is missed, and you cannot activate the optional effect. Cards that activate during the damage step are cards that activate only when they are destroyed and sent to the graveyard by battle or by card effect or both. Optional effects that don't miss the timing are optional effects that are activated "If..." something happens or "After..." something happens. Effects like these can never miss the timing. The lore for Snake Whistle says "Activate only when a Reptile-Type monster you control is destroyed. Special Summon 1 Level 4 or lower Reptile-Type monster from your Deck." This means you can activate this card ONLY when the Reptile-type monster is destroyed and nothing else happens after that. Since Viper took Battle Damage after Venom Snake was destroyed in battle by Plasma Vice he couldn't have activated Snake Whistle since Venom Snake was not destroyed by an effect. If the lore said "If" or "After" then Snake's Whistle's effect would have been allowed to activate since optional effects that occur "If..." or "After..." something happens never miss the timing. Cardsknower (talk • contribs) 01:34, July 24, 2011 (UTC)Cardsknower
- Null and Void says "Activate only when an effect of drawing card(s) is activated.", but can be activated in the Damage Step, due to rulings.
- Like I said above, this is not a Timing issue, this is an issue on whether a card can or cannot be activated in the Damage Step. -Falzar FZ- (talk page|useful stuff) 02:32, July 24, 2011 (UTC)
The rulings of Snake Whistle say you can't activate the card during the damage step. Null and Void can be activated in the damage step but only if no other effect happens after the cards are drawn. Cards that are destroyed or sent to the graveyard or are removed from the field have differiating effects depending on what the lore and the rulings say. The effects of cards like Null and Void can be activated during the damage step but only if no other effect occurs after this occurs. Effects that say "if" or "after" can be activated at anytime when the conditions occur. (such as Elemental Hero Darkbright's effect)
- If the lore says that the effect can activate only when it is destroyed by battle and sent to the graveyard or destroyed and sent to the graveyard then you can activate it in the Damage step, but only if no other effect comes after this happens. (Hero Signal and Water Dragon both have effects like that)
- If the lore says that the effect can activate only when it is removed from the field, you can activate it in the damage step as long as there is no effect that comes after the card is removed from the field. You can activate the effect if the effect returns the card to your hand but not if the effect returns the card to the deck since you have to shuffle your deck if a card goes back to the deck. Fusion Monsters and Synchro Monsters do not count on the above sentence since they go back to the Extra Deck which can't be shuffled. (Mokey Mokey King and Yubel - Terror Incarnate have effects like that)
- If the lore says that effect can activate only when it is destroyed, then you can only activate it if a card effect destroyed a card and nothing else (like battle damage or other effects) happens after that. Cards that say that can't be activated during the damage step. (Snake Whistle and Rise of the Snake Deity have that effect)
- If the lore says that effect can activate only when it is sent to the graveyard then it activates only when it is discarded from your hand or destroyed by either battle or card effect and no other effect happens after that Cards that have this effect can be activated during the damage step. (Peten the Dark Clown has that effect)
This should be enough to tell you which cards can be activated in the Damage Step and which can't. If not then you can check the rulings of the cards I mention here. Cardsknower (talk • contribs) 03:23, July 24, 2011 (UTC)Cardsknower
Still I was wanting to know if you have figured out that Snake Whistle can't be activated during the damage step. I was trying to show proof to you that it couldn't have been activated like it was done in the anime. I am only trying to explain why this card could not have activated during the damage step, but you seem to still deny this (because FredCat100 does not believe that lore and has told you to help discuss if the effect is true or not) despite how much evidence and proof I am showing to you here. If you don't believing what I am saying then I am not changing your choice. Cardsknower (talk • contribs) 04:09, July 24, 2011 (UTC)Cardsknower
- The thing is; even if the only difference was 'if' and 'when', it wouldn't make a difference here.
- Fredcat removed it because he knows that the anime can sometimes have the same effect, but is used in a different way, just to make the duels work in the show.
- However, if you add something like "when... destroyed (either by battle or by card effect)" (similar to Scrap Twin Dragon), then it would make it really clear; unless there is a lore shown in the anime which says otherwise (which is why I asked above).
- but I wouldn't remove the effect anyways. -Falzar FZ- (talk page|useful stuff) 04:15, July 24, 2011 (UTC)