Forum:Featured Card Problems/Featured Card Commitee Set-Up

I am trying to fix several things that are wrong in the front page. I am talking about the Snowman eater subject. It lacks to explain a lot of important information, it explains it's effect wrong, and the last paragraph is plain wrong. Either someone fix that or tell me how to, cause the edit button isn't in the Featured Card part of the Front Page. Thanks in advance. --Yes, im Pato (talk • contribs) 08:22, September 5, 2012 (UTC)

I see that article said it "removed" important monster, like Thunder King Rai-Oh, etc. and had plenty information of how it work. Is your brain broke or something? --iFredCat 09:33, September 5, 2012 (UTC)

Oh, you made it personal? Oh that's great. I was hoping some day you'd show the dick personality, in a more direct way.

Now I have to chose, Either I play polite, and show the many mistakes in the article, and show how you may be the one with mental problems; Plain insult your ass for treating me poorly as a starter, or any other way that would basically insult your way of living.

Let's see, I'll do the first one. I don't feel like insulting, and, having people like you play this game is insult enough, for the rest of us tho.

Ok, here we go:

• "(...)being a great answer to big monsters that are otherwise hard to deal with such as "Legendary Six Samurai - Shi En" " Read shi en, then see how many times does shi en remain alone in the field, and then Go **** yourself with a cactus. ¿Too direct?
• "When "Snowman Eater" is flipped face-up, you can destroy 1 face-up opponent's monster." Read the card, Read the card, Read the card.
• " the almighty "Gungnir, Dragon of the Ice Barrier", a power card that will likely see increased play due to the banning of its two Dragon of the Ice Barrier brethren. " YES! Now, as Carrier Zenmaighty was limited, Zenmaister will be an extra staple.
• "ranging from "Archlord Kristya" to "Elemental HERO The Shining"." The first goes to the top, and, Assuming that the person with kristia on field doesn't have an orange herald, kristia will appear next turn. Yet, as kristia will probably die in it's player's turn, This will allow that player to go bananas with the SS's, and set up thing for the appeareance of christia, next turn. Shinning? With every deck maining and siding taker? FRTD. I honestly would brather that you'd say alius.
• Not 1 sentence explained one of the most important things: IT ACTIVATES IN DAMAGE. Let's see. Spark in damage? Nope. Veiler in damage? nope. setable S/T card against the Hero OTK? No, sir, it's a monster.

I would like to enhance the part where you go do yourself with a cactus, but, you get the idea

Bye Bye.--Yes, im Pato (talk • contribs) 22:28, September 5, 2012 (UTC)

The featured articles aren't perfect that's true, and maybe some parts are a little odd or don't make a bunch of sense when you think about it. But the bottom line to it was that Snowman Eater is a great card that destroys a monster and can usually stay on the field. I don't know who wrote that one, and you'd have to check the edits to the Featured Card section to see them. But the card articles aren't written by the wiki admin or staff, but by maybe 1 or 2 wiki users, and we don't have a huge staff reading and giving advice on them before they are published (Maybe we should...).

---Dark Ace SP (Talk) 01:26, September 7, 2012 (UTC)

It's a great card, noone says otherwise. The article, is both confusing, missleading, and was written plain wrong. I can fix it. I just need someone to tell me how to edit that page. Hell, I could even write a new one instead of just editing that one. I'll leave that to administrators, but now, there's a wrong article in the front page of this wikia; That's kinda a big deal. --Yes, im Pato (talk • contribs) 01:48, September 7, 2012 (UTC)

You can edit it at Yu-Gi-Oh!:Featured Card/Snowman Eater, but before you do anything I suggest asking User:YamiWheeler, at his talk page, he's the one who made it, and you can tell him about your concerns, just be as polite as possible, and I think he'll help to edit those. ---Dark Ace SP (Talk) 01:59, September 7, 2012 (UTC)

Do NOT edit the article without first consulting the original writer. Bring up any and all issues with the article. The only editing that should be done by others are grammatical fixes and linking. DemonGodAsura (talk • contribs) 02:04, September 7, 2012 (UTC)

I've been meaning to make a topic concerning Featured Card articles. Basically, I want to make a call for people to write and peer review them so that a new one is added at the beginning of the month. With several peoples' opinions, they will be of higher quality. Yami's already on board for being part of a group in the future. --Golden Key (talk • contribs) 02:05, September 7, 2012 (UTC)

I would be willing to join this committee. DemonGodAsura (talk • contribs) 02:08, September 7, 2012 (UTC)

I'd be up for it too, I know I tried this with the Deck Guides (Failed and Gadjil is probably kinda mad at me...), but I actually can help review some of the articles before they go out. ---Dark Ace SP (Talk) 02:18, September 7, 2012 (UTC)

On a side note, it's kinda interesting that I posted, "...and we don't have a huge staff reading and giving advice on them before they are published (Maybe we should...)." above and now we're trying to form a small staff for the featured card articles. Ahh, the irony. ---Dark Ace SP (Talk) 02:21, September 7, 2012 (UTC)

Well, I don't visit Wikia too often other than to look up cards, however, YamiWheeler is a frequent IRC user, where I generally reside, so I can easily be reached there. I'd be willing to set aside the 10 minutes a month, or however far apart, to review content. DemonGodAsura (talk • contribs) 02:33, September 7, 2012 (UTC)

Exactly, we only have the Card Articles maybe once or twice a month (I think), and it doesn't take much to read an article for a few minutes are then give your personal thoughts and constructive criticism of it. ---Dark Ace SP (Talk) 03:25, September 7, 2012 (UTC)

I think the issue is your personal problem with the article, Pato M. FYI, your edits were horrible and they have been reverted. I have work for the time being, but if I return and am not busy later, I'll be happy to go over them and explain to you how your added points do not matter. Do not just edit a featured card article in future. It isn't yours to edit. You bring up your issues with the writer, and they decide if they want to make the changes to the article or not.--YamiWheeler (talk • contribs) 08:48, September 7, 2012 (UTC)

Don't wanna make a huge shock to you, but, here's a little secret: the article, is from the comunity, for the comunity. I believe your edits are horrrible, and, thinking that my objective point of view was made for a personal problem of mine with the article, just makes me feel like you have a personal problem with your edits getting undone. I mean, why would i have a personal problem, with an article that is just written wrong. I have a problem cause it missleads, doesn't show many good sides of it's effect, shows a lot of (I don't think noobness is a word, but, pretendt it is. Ever played tengu plants? Know the problems it has with extra deck size? Of course you don't.)

Your article has the basis, but, it cab be improved. Now, take your head off your behind and leave the article as it is.

One more thing. Don't change my edits without asking. I told you when i edited yours, so the less i can ask is for you to do the same. --Yes, im Pato (talk • contribs) 09:46, September 7, 2012 (UTC)

FredCat, you were asked to stop these insults a few days ago. The "brain broke" comment was unnecessary and provocative.

Pato, you've also been warned about your attitude to other users. Comments like "**** a cactus", "noobness" and "take your head off your behind" aren't helping the matter at hand. It's clear you have some logical points to make, but you'll get a better reaction if you don't insult people like this.

The two of you have had bad encounters with each other on this site. I hope you can put them behind yourselves. You're both here to help the community and have worthwhile additions to make. And we should appreciate that, but both of you have gotten away with insulting each other and other users before and I don't think that should be tolerated much further.

Dark Ace, DGA and Golden Key are taking a calm approach to this. Can everyone else do the same, please?

I think Golden Key's suggestion is good and something we should have set up a long time ago. It should hopefully prevent conflicts like this in future. -- Deltaneos (talk) 11:40, September 7, 2012 (UTC)

Thank you, Delta. Here are two things I have in mind for improvements;

1. We need to be more consistent with their creation dates. Some have been up for months, others under one month. Once a month seems best to me, and we should always strive to have it by the first of the month.

2. We need to have a way of choosing what cards get featured. Ideas:

A A volunteer could submit a group of cards in a poll and then, after a few days, write about the one that received the most votes.

B Several writers could write about different cards, we do a poll to pick which article is the best written. Ideas on how to further improve the winning article can then be given. Those whose articles were not chosen can revise and resubmit their articles every month. --Golden Key (talk • contribs) 15:51, September 7, 2012 (UTC)

The issue here at the moment isn't how to start up the Featured Card Committee, the issue is that Pato M seems to think he has a special privilege on this site to edit other people's work. This Featured Card article does not belong to the community - I wrote it myself. It is my article. He was told by DGA and myself to get permission before editing, and still persisted in reverting my undoing of his edit. I don't think that he's a good candidate for the Featured Card article committee, as he has absolutely no regard for procedure or rules, something which is necessary when writing these articles. I had several issues with the Madolche Queen Tiaramisu article, and I brought it up on the talk page of the user who wrote them, and when he chose to ignore them, I had to accept that, but because Pato M personally is incapable of understanding the article, he thinks he has a right to just go in and edit it. Frankly, it pisses me off, and that's why he was met with a venomous response on my talk page. TBH, I don't know why he's still even allowed here, because this is not the first time he's broken rules. It's an ongoing trend that is unlikely to stop because he has no respect for anyone or anything except for his own misguided ideas. Unlike FredCat, who can be a little silly and rude, and unlike my explosiveness and rashness, he just has no respect at all, and frankly, something needs to be done about it. I will be calm when he obeys procedure and stops editing things that he has no right to touch.--YamiWheeler (talk • contribs) 18:09, September 7, 2012 (UTC)

Debunking Pato's Issues

"(...)being a great answer to big monsters that are otherwise hard to deal with such as "Legendary Six Samurai - Shi En"
Pato M: [some incomprehensible gibberish]

Back when Legendary Six Samurai were big, Snowman Eater was a good answer to turn 1 Shi En and still is. Just because it can save itself doesn't mean it will always be able to. That's like saying "Solemn Warning" isn't a good answer to "Black Rose Dragon" because they might have "Solemn Judgment". Snowman Eater is still a good answer to Shi En.

"When "Snowman Eater" is flipped face-up, you can destroy 1 face-up opponent's monster."'
Pato M: Read the card, Read the card, Read the card.

I have read the card. I am not Konami, I do not need to be so direct with every sentence I make. can is referring to its ability to destroy a monster. It is not saying it is optional. Anyone who reads the card can see it isn't optional. You are not my audience, Pato. My audience should be intelligent enough to gauge this without needing me to spoon feed them.

"the almighty "Gungnir, Dragon of the Ice Barrier", a power card that will likely see increased play due to the banning of its two Dragon of the Ice Barrier brethren."
Pato M: YES! Now, as Carrier Zenmaighty was limited, Zenmaister will be an extra staple.

I don't even understand your point. Did I say it would be a staple? I said it would have increased play, and it was already looking to be a popular option for Plants at the time of writing the article, which was before the first YCS. You don't even have a leg to stand-on here. It's basically "Pato disagrees." Guess what, I don't give a shit.

"ranging from "Archlord Kristya" to "Elemental HERO The Shining"."
Pato M: The first goes to the top, and, Assuming that the person with kristia on field doesn't have an orange herald, kristia will appear next turn. Yet, as kristia will probably die in it's player's turn, This will allow that player to go bananas with the SS's, and set up thing for the appeareance of christia, next turn. Shinning? With every deck maining and siding taker? FRTD. I honestly would brather that you'd say alius.

Right, so I'm supposed to list every potential scenario that could happen? What the hell do you think this is? A Featured Card article is supposed to sell a card and tell you its potential uses. It can destroy "Archlord Kristya" and is a good answer to it considering if you can't Special Summon anymore, you have very few ways to destroy it, minus cards like "Dark Hole" and Traps. As for "Elemental HERO The Shining", it is a problem card for a lot of decks because they can't get over high ATK like that. Even if they do get back their cards when you destroy it, at least it takes 3200 ATK OFF THE BOARD. And look at YCS Toronto's deck lists. Who the fuck was maining "Soul Taker"? A few people sided it, but only like 1 deck list comes to mind that mained it. Several decks were maining Snowman Eater, though.

Pato M: Not 1 sentence explained one of the most important things: IT ACTIVATES IN DAMAGE. Let's see. Spark in damage? Nope. Veiler in damage? nope. setable S/T card against the Hero OTK? No, sir, it's a monster.

First of all, it does not activate during the Damage Step. It only does if they attack into it, and that should be obvious to the reader. My readers aren't as stupid as you. I don't feel the need to spell every single game mechanic out to them. The "Elemental HERO Neos Alius" and "Gemini Spark" suggestion is the only one of yours that has any value. Perhaps I could add that in.

All in all, Pato M is full of shit. Many of his "suggestions" are things he doesn't like. Guess what, tough. I'm not changing anything that is perfectly fine just to please you. Before I submitted the article, I ran it by several actually good players, one of them being DGA, to get their opinions on it (as I always do), and they thought it was fine. Since writing the article, I have only received positive comments, except from you. Incomprehensible complaints from a clown who can't grasp the concept of the English language, let alone a card article. If you ever in future write an article (lol), then you can write it as badly as you want, but my article will be staying exactly how I intended it to be, plus any alterations I decide to make of my own will. I don't expect anything more than more incomprehensible crying from this fool in response, but I feel that I've defended my points clearly. If anyone agrees with Pato M, or wishes to bring up an issue relating to one of these points, please feel free to talk to me personally. I am happy to accept criticism as long as it is done in a respectful manner, and as long as people respect the fact that it is my work and any edits should go through me. The frosty reception that Pato M has received is simply a mirror of his own behaviour towards everyone else, and the Wiki as a whole.--YamiWheeler (talk • contribs) 18:28, September 7, 2012 (UTC)

Ok, let's see. Just of the start, let me say this. You called me a fucker, you told me I'm full of shit, You told me I'm not Intelligent enough, you told me you don't give a shit about any of my edits, you called me stupid. This was followed by you telling me I'm full of shit, again. Then, "clown who can't grasp the concept of the English language". Then "crying fool", but, then, the happy ending: "I am happy to accept criticism as long as it is done in a respectful manner". You see, that's called irony. Just so you know, I really hope an administrator will deal with you, just so you regret every single thing you said to me. Ok, now that your lack of manners has been exposed, let me show how your points fail:

• Six samurai decks spam. Not 1 six samurai player will end a turn with just a shi-en on field. Not 1. If he does, guess what's the face down: something to protect shi-en.
• No, reading the effect of the card refers to what it does. You have to be direct, it's just how it works. Oh, and, I really shouldn't be saying it like this, but the first day of a format, i won the play-a-mat and qualified for both nationals and south american continentals, and I know saying "I don't wanna sound cocky" is cliche, but I'll use it, as a respectful way to tell you to enjoy your night with the cactus. Hope you two have little Cactus Bounzer children. I use snowman eater in decks since 2011. I know the card, I know in what moments it works, and I know many things about the card that i really think you don't, but, as I'm not sure, I will not tell you that you are full of ****. That's unpolite.
• You still don't get it? I'm not saying that you have a limited mind, but, you see, A card like gugnir won't see more play just because brionac is banned. A card like gravity warrior may, yet won't. Gugnir and brionac? Oranges and apples.
• You have to list possible scenarios. Otherwise, you would say that siding in snowman against dino rabbit is bad "cause maybe he goes into dolkka first turn". No, Possible scenarios. Scenarios that will happen. I listed some that have a high chance of happening. Have you ever played against agents? This is an honest question, cause it seriously looks like you just watch games out of youtube.

Oh and, let's see:

• http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/376781_10150986236021511_1673886607_n.jpg Top 32 Winning Deck Profile Tyler Tadeo.

http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/295184_10150986310906511_1860698336_n.jpg Top 16 Winning Deck Profile Sean Montague.

http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/217070_10150986360451511_1459071472_n.jpg Top 16 Winning Deck Profile Michael Boyd.

http://a4.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/419305_10150986371191511_1882551656_n.jpg 3rd Place Jordan Kornntoff.

http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/528115_10150986453151511_1850582482_n.jpg Top 32 Winning Deck Profile Ryad Hamw.

Ouch! In-The-Butt. You should really, really tell those guys that they are not smart, and, more importantly, that they do not exist. I honestly am Laughting out loud at the moment.

• Wait, I'm confused, you said It didn't activate in the damage step, and then you said, it did. My judges sences ar tingling.

The people that start reading a book, know very few of it. The very first thing they see is the cover. Now, if the cover of a book is the one from "The Hunger Games", and inside, you have a "Twilight" book, someone is going to be mad, cause he was missleaded by the front page. What I'm trying to say is, the front page is visited by everyone, and, most of us, experienced people in these "Books", no longer look at the front page. Yet, you know who does do it? People who didn't read the book.

Also, Sorry if i don't write articles? I don't know, almost noone does it, and, honestly, i work, go to college, and play this game. I'm sorry if i don't have time to make out of thin air a new article. Yet, editing an erroneus article takes me 5 minutes, that i can use, to make this wikia better. If i'd ever write an article, everyone is more than invited to correct it if wrong.

Regarding the "clown who can't grasp the concept of the English language", I do not tolerate people who insult me, that's for starters. After that, I told you, that you did have my permission to check my grammar, and correct it if i was wrong. What you did there was just plain rude. As polite as i can say it, after all you told me, Go fuck yourself. --Yes, im Pato (talk • contribs) 20:27, September 7, 2012 (UTC)

Rebuttal

Aw, I'm soooooo sorry if I offended you. Maybe if you didn't act like a dick, that wouldn't be sarcasm. Let's start with this: My comment at the end is clearly directed at OTHER PEOPLE. People who don't edit my article without asking first, people who don't immediately get overly sensitive whenever someone makes even the slightest suggestion that they may be wrong, and most importantly, people who aren't completely unreasonable. Does that sound like you? Not in the slightest, so why are you using the example of how I treat you to try to debunk that? Could it be your lack of understanding of the English language rearing its ugly head again? Quite possibly. And you talking about lack of manners is absolutely hilarious. Really. It's the funniest thing you've ever said.

Six Samurai Decks - so you think that every Six Samurai player will have the ability to open all of the cards they need to have Shi En + monsters to protect it? Let's see, so they'd need to open either the materials to make Shi En + Gate or the materials to make Shi En + Kizan/Grandmaster. That's gonna happen EVERY game. lolok. Eater was used as a good check for Shi En way back when Samurais were big, and is still a good check, especially since it deals with so many other monsters in other match-ups. I'm not editing it based on "they could have x card."

I'm not 'reading' the effect of the card, I'm explaining what it does. Most people who have a sufficient understanding of English will know what I mean. You do not, so you have an issue with it. This is an English Wiki. I am writing for an English audience. I'm sorry, you'll just have to deal with it. As for your 'credentials', I really couldn't care less. Anyone can say anything on the internet. Top a YCS if you're so good and maybe I'll give a crap. FYI, people have been using Snowman Eater for a long, long time, which I've mentioned in the article, so you using it since 2011 is hardly an achievement. These 'special' Pato techniques of using Snowman Eater are intriguing, though. Please feel free to elaborate on these.

"Brionac, Dragon of the Ice Barrier" and "Trishula, Dragon of the Ice Barrier" were massive power cards in Plant decks. With them both gone, and with Snowman Eater a viable card to be mained in the deck, it allows them access to Gungnir, which is a power card Plants can use. Therefore, if Plants are running it, then its use goes up. You seem to be smudging the border between "increase of use" and "staple." But we'll just blame your lack of English knowledge on that.

Why would you write a Featured Card article and list weaknesses of a card? Obviously "Herald of Orange Light" and "Effect Veiler" are weaknesses. Why would I need to state that? Who has ever mentioned these issues when writing a Featured Card article? As for potential situations, the opponent could have any card at any time. "Evolzar Laggia" is a bad card, because they might have Warning! 2/40 cards. Herald is 3/40 cards. Once again, I'm not changing anything.

Wow, 5/32 people ran "Soul Taker". That's reeeeeally everyone. Just because someone tops a YCS also doesn't make them a Yu-Gi-Oh! God. Some of the decklists from the Top 32 were awful, which is also to be expected considering it was literally Day 1 of the format. Soul Taker was used last format, those 5 people that used it may have simply carried it over. Let's take a look at how many people ran Snowman Eater:

Josh Gramham - Wind-Ups - 1st Place mained 2, sided 1.

Peter Tran - Wind-Ups - 4th place sided 3.

Bo Tang - Dino Rabbit - Top 16 mained 2.

Daniel Lamartina - HEROes - Top 16 sided 2.

Sean Montogue - HEROes - Top 16 sided 2.

Michael Boyd - Wind-Up - Top 16 mained 2.

Hareesh Watson - Wind-Up - Top 16 mained 1, sided 1.

Joe Andreeas - Karakuri Geargia - Top 32 mained 3.

Louis Hong - HEROes - Top 32 mained 1, sided 1.

Luiz Jiminez - Bubble Beat - Top 32 sided 1.

Wassim Yassine - Dino Rabbit - Top 32 sided 2.

That's 11 players. 11/32. That's over a third of players, including the winner, who ran Snowman Eater. The word owned comes to mind.

You don't have any "judge senses", or as you like to call it, "judges sences." Does the card say "Activate during the Damage Step"? No? Could it be your lack of comprehension of the English language making you misunderstand yet again? Yes? The card does not exclusively activate during the Damage Step. The card can also be Flip Summoned, or flipped face-up by other means ("Photon Papilloperative"), and its effect will activate outside of the Damage Step. Therefore, it does not only activate in the Damage Step like you were insinuating.

You will never write an article because you don't have the grammatical comprehension required to write one. The way you 'edited my erroneous article' to make the 'Wikia better' was an offence to the English language. Clearly, you think your grammar is great, which is even more dangerous - you are so deluded that you can't even see a flaw as obvious as that, but we knew that, because you've also deluded yourself into believing that you aren't a rude person. If you had any sort of artistic merit in anything you did, you would know that going ahead and editing someone else's work without permission is very much so rude, but that's only the bottom of the barrel for you. As for you not tolerating people who insult you? Who cares.--YamiWheeler (talk • contribs) 21:04, September 7, 2012 (UTC)

I was asked by the head administrator to stop threatening you, and, as I know that you cannot keep a conversation with me, I'll stop this as i write this sentence, telling you that my edit was the final. Please save yourself the trouble of talking to me cause I honestly don't respect you enough to talk to someone with your vocabulary. That'd be all. Do not insult me ever again. --Yes, im Pato (talk • contribs) 22:44, September 7, 2012 (UTC)

You Leave for 24 Hours and this happens...

Alright, so let's just let the dust settle on the featured card issue. It's not that big of a deal, and the article did it's main job, which was to sell Eater, which I think it did. But I really do think we should move on to the 2nd part of what has emerged from this discussion. The need to form a good group of people to act as editors and creators for the card articles. Adding on to what Golden Key stated:

• The articles really should be published on the front page at the start of every month, and only letting it go once a month is fine (Unless we get like 3-4 Killer Amazing cards in the same pack or set).

• We really should have a better way to choose what cards get selected. I know that we have a Featured Card page that has been put into the Sticky Threads section on one of the forums, but it's never really used, and goes unedited for months at a time. -Dark Ace SP (Talk) 04:00, September 8, 2012 (UTC)

I feel that featured cards should be cards that create variety in a Deck or is an unheralded tech. Snowman fits the "tech" side. As for this, I think cards like Grandsoil, Moulin Glace, etc, are the types of cards that really need no explaining. They're power-house cards on their own that are quite straight forward, and have no actual combos aside from "revive a Lv8 monster, and Xyz Summon a R8". DemonGodAsura (talk • contribs) 05:50, September 9, 2012 (UTC)