Forum:January 2014 Banlist Predictions (TCG)

We're still a bit early for this (2 months from January), but since the list will be updated in January instead of March, we should probably begin this. Here are my current thoughts on what the TCG should do:

Banned:
 * Sixth Sense - Stupid card. 'Nuff said.
 * Return from the Different Dimension - A win-button in Rulers.
 * Macro Cosmos - It stops you from playing yugioh...and fact is, most decks are graveyard-reliant these days. This card should learn from Royal Oppression and Shock Master and get banned.
 * Dimensional Fissure - Same as Macro Cosmos.
 * Soul Drain - Same as Macro Cosmos.
 * Eradicator Epidemic Virus - Also a win-button, and it says you can't play, like the above cards.
 * Dark Hole - We don't need any staples like this card in the game.

Limited:
 * Blaster, Redox, Tempest, and Tidal - Rulers have ruined this game for long enough, they need to go now.
 * Super Rejuvenation - With all of the babies gone, and the daddies probably going to 1, this card has no need to stay gone.
 * Something else from the forbidden list? (Sinister Serpent, DMoC, Faith, TER, TIV, ect). I'm not sure.

Semi-Limited
 * Chaos Sorcerer - Give Twilight decks a little push.
 * Neo-Spacian Grand Mole - The TCG should follow the OCG on this and Chaos Sorcerer. The decks that use this don't do anything anymore.
 * Gladiator Beast Bestiari - When was the last time Glads did anything? (Same as Sorc and Mole)
 * Reinforcement of the Army - Warrior decks could use a little love.

Unlimited:
 * One Day of Peace - So long as Mind Augus is limited, Gishki FTK is impossible, so why keep this card at 1?
 * Magical Stone Excavation - Doesn't see play anymore, so why not?

Well, that's my current thoughts on what the TCG should do. Any criticism or comments? Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 16:58, October 22, 2013 (UTC)


 * Hmm, Stratos can stay gone. He's not bad, but his card design is, you get a search anytime he's summoned, and if he comes back, you need to semi-limit Malicious and the other cards that supported HEROs. Not worth hitting five cards for one. Card Destruction can also stay gone, it was a indirect hit on Dark Worlds, and it's proved to be too big of a win-button. I also don't want Heavy back, with 3 MST, back row isn't that bad. One Day is more of an issue with Exodia and Final Countdown. One more card I want semi-limited is Rekindling, I don't want it to go any lower than that though. Lavals and Flamvells have a right to be playable archetypes. -- Dark Ace SP ( Talk ) 13:02, October 25, 2013 (UTC)

all i wanna see is dragon rulers absolutely destroyed those things never should've existed in the first placeDennis.vanderwiele (talk • contribs) 13:22, October 25, 2013 (UTC)

Card Destruction was mainly a hit on Rulers, but all the daddies need to go to 1, or to 0 and unlimit the babies. Dragon Rulers should be a playable archetype, but not the way they are now. They need different support in my opinion, like monsters that can tutor the babies for rank 3-4 xyz summons and kill the daddies since they abuse everything. Dark Worlds could've been a little crazy with Card Destruction I guess. Being a HERO player myself, Stratos is probably a bit biased choice of mine, but HERO's weren't doing much with or without it so I can understand it coming back, or staying banned by what you said. If Stratos doesn't come back, they should probably semi-limit ROTA. Since Six Sams and HERO's lost their best cards, they need all the help they can get. One Day of Peace, same for Stratos, biased, but Exodia and Countdown, they aren't doing much anyways.

Furthermore, I could also see them outright banning the grave-stoppers (Macro Cosmos, Dimensional Fissure, and Soul Drain), as well as Eradicator Epidemic Virus. Let's face it, the game has turned incredibly graveyard-reliant over the past few years and those three cards basically say "you can't play yugioh", just like Royal Oppression and Shock Master did, and they're also banned. Eradicator is a one-sided mass removal card that shuts down entire decks on it's own, it wouldn't surprise me if it got banned too. I also wouldn't mind seeing Dark Hole get banned just like Heavy and Reborn, no staples actually sounds pretty fun. Rekindling is a win-button, but they need to give FIRE-types more support and make a watered-down version of it first, in my opinion. Then they can outright ban that mass spam summoner. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 14:18, October 25, 2013 (UTC)

Remind me how frequently Macro-centric anti-meta has made it in the tournament scene, prior to September? --Gadjiltron (talk • contribs) 15:00, October 25, 2013 (UTC)
 * Gadjiltron, it doesn't have to be a deck centered around main-decking it and topping for it to be banned, what Macro, Fissure, and Soul Drain basically say is "I get to use my cards, you don't get to use yours because everything you need has to go to the grave." That's basically saying "you can't play yugioh", because the fact is, as much as I want to deny it, most of the decks in the current meta like to set up their graveyard for effects there. Furthermore, there's a good chance that any future decks Konami makes will be graveyard-reliant decks too. Not a good way of selling cards when those cards are in the game, is it? And limiting them to 1 just makes it a main-deck staple. Solution? Ban it. Furthermore, inconsistent ≠ balanced. Gateway of the Six was inconsistent and Six Sams hardly topped any tournaments, and look what happened to that card. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 15:58, October 25, 2013 (UTC)
 * So, in your opinion, what broke Macro and D-Fissure? They had been around since EOJ, only began seeing significance since PTDN and LODT (DAD and Lightsworns), but hadn't been paid any mind until September 2013. What happened then? I understand some old cards have their reasons (Gateway because LSS, Cold Wave because GB and pals), but I'm not seeing much which exploits Macro and D-Fissure more than before. --Gadjiltron (talk • contribs) 02:14, October 26, 2013 (UTC)

I dont see macro ever being banned, Faggot dragons burn in hell where you belong. " Something else from the forbidden list? (Sinister Serpent, DMoC, Faith, TER, TIV, ect). I'm not sure." Faith, MAYBE id like to see her back. the rest are game-breakers and were banned for a reason. Generic backrow and heavy can stay gone, games more fun without them. Also, MST at 3, how is a limited copy of macro "Not Yugioh anymore"? if countering grave relient decks is banworthy and gamebreaking, why isnt the gravekeepers topping tournys or on that list...?DreadKaiser (talk • contribs) 17:36, October 25, 2013 (UTC)
 * Updated my predictions, I think this is it...


 * Check again, Gravekeeper's lost one of their Royal Tributes this format, and Necrovalley doesn't stop effects activating in the grave, like Dark Worlds or banishing Rulers from your hand. Dragon Rulers always find an out to everything. Either limit all the daddies to 1, or ban Tempest, Redox, Blaster, and Tidal and unlimit Burner, Reactan, Lightning, and Stream. And how is MST at 3 an argument against Macro? Would Royal Oppression be fine at 1 with 3 MST to stop it? Didn't think so. Ever heard of Master Key Beetle before?


 * Faith and DMoC will not come back unless Dark Hole is banned so there's nothing good you can get back with their effects, and Sinister Serpent, Tribe-Infecting Virus, and Thousand-Eyes Restrict are all a bunch of garbage cards from goat format that would hardly do anything if they returned in the current format.


 * Sinister Serpent? What will you do with it? Mermails and Dark Worlds already discard better cards that actually get cool effects when discarded and running terrible cards like Lightning Vortex or Divine Wrath just to make Serpent usable is an inconsistent, trashy mess.
 * TER? Metamorphosis is banned. It stays banned. Polymerization on Thousand-Eyes Idol and Relinquished is a -3 on your hand. No one would do that. Use Instant Fusion, TER can't attack and it dies in the end phase. Bad version of Soul Taker. Enlighten me otherwise.
 * TIV? Snipe Hunter's at 3 and can get rid of any card, including backrow, TIV only kills monsters, and it's not good in any deck except Mermails, which could use a boost.
 * Well, nothing needs to come off the forbidden list, but, in my opinion, something should. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 18:52, October 25, 2013 (UTC)

1, Not every deck can easily run Master key beetle. 2, Believe it or not, Master key beetle can actually die (cough COMPULSE, DPRISON cough), and may actually make it EASIER to kill macro by killing this, 2500 ATK isn't hard to top. if they dont use Macro as a shield, MST it then. if you still have an issue with stopping backrow, consider running Decrees or Dust tornado. If you STILL have an issue just popping 1 face-up trap....then i just say "Wow" and walk away. Macro is annoying as hell, but not ban-worthy. And master key beetle isn't a reason it should be for the same reason people laugh off the "It can be countered, so it can come off banlist" arguement. 3, snipe hunters is at 3 because its a gamble effect and it can only costs 1 card per attempt and can only pop one card if it works. TIV can potentially wipe fields for 1 card and has no gamble for it to do so. that's like comparing Pot of greed to any of its many watered down versions. Just because they are around @3 doesn't mean the grossly superior version should come back. Also, TIV plus Zombie skull archfiend and ZW = cheap nukes/Raigeki. So no, mermails aren't the only things that can benefit from this coming off either. Hell anything can use it as a cheap nuke, especially if they are up against a mono-type deck.DreadKaiser (talk • contribs) 23:48, October 25, 2013 (UTC)

also, Instant fusion TER. it dies, Call is at 3, rez it. there are plenty of cards to do so with (instant fusion DOES count as fusion summon). Master key beetle Call/TER itself, or just book it at any point in that sentence. You have been enlightened.DreadKaiser (talk • contribs) 00:05, October 26, 2013 (UTC)
 * You apparently haven't faced a decent deck using Key Beetle in a while. Evilswarms are one of the best decks that can use it, but Blackwings, Infernities, Zombies, and just about any deck that can splash Kagetokage and Instant Fusion for Kamionwizard can throw it in the extra as well. And Macro isn't the only problem with Key Beetle. Using it to protect Imperial Iron Wall, Vanity's Emptiness, Soul Drain, and especially Safe Zone makes Key Beetle a pain, if not impossible, to overcome, depending on the deck you're using. Compulsory is at 1, you won't always get to use it, and D-Prison requires an attack, again, you won't always get to use it. Not every deck can run Royal Decree either, or run it without hurting itself and you can't mst the card Key Beetle protects if they protect it while they set it on their turn.


 * TIV can be used in several decks, but the only deck that would really benefit from it's discard cost is Mermails, so they get a +1 from pitching their Infantry or Marksman. In other decks, it's gimmicky and would lower consistency more often than not. In all honesty, I don't expect Tribe to be the very next card to come off, but in all honesty there are plenty of better cards than him anyways. Then again, at the same time, there are also many better cards to unban before Tribe-Infecting Virus.


 * TER can't attack and dies in the end phase you Instant Fusion it. Call of the Haunted is bad. It's not a problem card in of itself, hence why it's unlimited because it's too slow and too easy to play around. There are not only plenty of better cards to revive with Call than TER, like Inzektor Dragonfly, Wind-Up Magician, and Infernity Archfiend so you can get into loops, but the only decks that would use Thousand-Eyes (Piper Chaos and Frog Monarchs) don't even run call of the haunted in the first place because it hurts their consistency to begin with, and running it just to reuse TER is terrible deck consideration. Hell Instant Fusion is better off being used for a rank 3-5 xyz summon or for huge synchro plays in Karakuris than being used as a one for one card that soul taker already does. Also, Soul Taker doesn't take up a space in your extra and can't be veiler'd, chalice'd, breakthrough'd, or fiendish'd. If you wanted to kill a monster use that instead of Instant Fusion. And Key Beetle is NEVER used to protect call of the haunted, let alone used in the decks that would run Thousand Eyes. Graceful Revival and Limit Reverse are more specific, and like Call, they're not hard to play around with or without TER, and again, it's downright bad deck building if you run Limit Reverse or Graceful Revival in any random deck just to revive TER. I can accept Kinka-Byo, maybe, but because the monster Kinka revives banishes in the end phase, you have to go for a rank 1 xyz like number 63 or Slacker Magician the turn it's summoned, which isn't half as good as the piper engine they already have. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 00:52, October 26, 2013 (UTC)

Ace's Revised Thoughts #1
Hmm...what a discussion.
 * The Rulers should be playable and having only 1 copy of each of the adults and 3 babies seems fine to me.
 * Hmm...I'm not sure what to say about Macro, Fissure, and Drain. They all stop you from playing Yu-Gi-Oh, but I think they might be necessary evils at one. However, having them leave the game wouldn't be that damaging. Or if anything, leave just one of the three at one, and my bet would be on Soul Drain.
 * I'm also a HERO player, and I'd love to see Stratos back, but I don't plan to let my emotions take over me. Stratos wasn't bad, but when half a dozen cards also need to be on the list for Stratos to be at one, it just doesn't seem to make mathematical sense.
 * TER could come to one, it might not be that bad. People said the same thing about BLS for years, and when BLS came off the list, we saw a rise in its use, but then it kinda faded away into a few decks that could actually use it reliably. Besides, TER's effect does not seem that bad. We can make the same case for The Atmosphere (It's summoning is laughable if you use Scapegoat.)
 * Faith could probably come back, maybe at one to avoid weird combos with One Day of Peace and Dark Hole. But coming back to 3 wouldn't suck that much either. But if you want Dark Hole banned, give me Mirror Force to 3.

-- Dark Ace SP ( Talk ) 02:48, October 26, 2013 (UTC)
 * I thought that Royal Oppression was a necessary evil to stop special summoning when it was at 1, but it got banned because, whether I want to admit it or not, virtually every deck in today's metagame loves to special summon constantly, so it had to go or the game wouldn't proceed. It would seem logical to take away the grave-stoppers for the same reason decks love to special summon, because they also like to use the graveyard, but I don't know how the TCG plans on doing that. The babies shouldn't come back unless their daddies get outright banned, because they'll just search them if the daddies are limited to 1. Heck, the daddy Rulers are STILL very playable even when they're limited to 1 because you can mix them with other dragon engines like Chaos Dragons, Dragunities, or Hieratics to tutor them out with Atum then make a lv 8 synchro with Dragunity Corseca, Flamvell Guard, or Veiler, not to mention Dragon Ravine can mill them. I already make lv 8 synchros very easily in my pure Hieratic build with Galaxy Serpent, they could easily run rulers to make them with Flamvell Guard (also searchable by Hieratic's effects). As much as I hate to say it, Rulers might have to die to make the game better. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 13:31, October 26, 2013 (UTC)


 * We could just leave the Rulers at 1 and the babies banned. -- Dark Ace SP ( Talk ) 14:30, October 26, 2013 (UTC)
 * I'd be fine with all of the Rulers at 1, but my point from before was even at 1 they can still be abused when thrown in with other Dragon engines. But for now, cutting the consistency as much as possible is the best thing to do I suppose. If variants of Rulers (Chaos Rulers, Dragunity Rulers, or Hieratic Rulers), still top tournaments after January, kill them. And kill them until there's nothing left. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 00:23, October 27, 2013 (UTC)

http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Forum:January_2014_Banlist_Predictions_(TCG)?action=edit#
 * The only one I can see still doing something is Dragunity, but it's not really because of Tempest. (Assuming all get Limited). Rather, Dragunity will do well because of Ravine and a more resilient strategy. -- Dark Ace SP ( Talk ) 16:33, October 27, 2013 (UTC)
 * And...no surprise, Rulers win YET ANOTHER YCS. At this point, I wouldn't be surprised if they outright kill that deck come January. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 21:40, October 29, 2013 (UTC)
 * Not only that, but from what I read, 7 of the Top 8 from the London YCS were Dragon Rulers :\. Yeah, they have to go. At least limit the seniors, though many will want them banned. Moja619 (talk • contribs) 23:29, October 29, 2013 (UTC)
 * And furthermore, 26 of the top 32 at London were either Dragon Rulers or Dragunity Rulers. :/ I never thought Rulers would ruin this format that badly. I wouldn't be surprised if they kill those derp-broke Dragons, but they'd better be limited to 1 at least. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 05:02, October 30, 2013 (UTC)

Predictions and thoughts from the non-meta
I'll start out by saying that as the title says, this is from a non-meta point of view. Having said that, I'll now get started with my predictions and reasons

Forbidden
 * Black Luster Soldier - Envoy of the Beginning - This and C-Sorc can't be at the same limit and C-Sorc is good at 1 IMO (I play both, and think BLS really should be gone)
 * Sixth Sense - Do I really need a reason for this
 * Number 11: Big Eye +1 to grave (which as we know is generally good) then Change of Heart happens for good

Limited
 * Tidal, Redox, Blaster, and Tempest - These guys hurt EVERYONE ALL THE TIME and just need to be cut down so hard
 * Maiden with Eyes of Blue - I play this card at 2, and it is way too good (for the crap I play against at least)
 * Dark Magician of Chaos - I know, Dark Hole is still a thing, but I can't see this being that good/OP at 1
 * Mecha Phantom Beast Dracossack - Although, if the big rulers are taken to 1, this won't be as much of a problem

Semi-Limited
 * Macro Cosmos and Dimensional Fissure - These being at 1 kinda kills the D.D. decks (granted there are the banishers (light and radiance) which should also be at 2), like seriously, without mad RFG power, how is Gren Maju Da Eiza, Golden Homunculus or D.D. Dynamite meant to be properly powerful

Unlimited
 * I can't think of any right now. ~F.~ 11:16, November 1, 2013 (UTC)

What you said on Dracossack is pretty much the same with Big Eye, if all of the daddies (Blaster, Redox, Tempest, and Tidal) go to 1, you don't really have to hit Big Eye. To be honest, I'm really annoyed at why they didn't just keep BLS gone and bring Chaos Sorcerer down to 2-3, chaos decks were just fine at that. Dark Magician of Chaos is bad, I can't believe it's still gone knowing Reborn is also gone, now there are no loops with it. I'm not sure about Blue-Eyed Maiden, I haven't seen it myself in a while so I can't say how good it can be if used right. The anti-meta cards (Macro and Fissure) do support decks like that but truth is, lots of decks like the graveyard these days...they could go the way of Royal Oppression and get banned, or Konami could have just been butthurt and unlimit them again just like they did with Skill Drain. I'm not 100% sure if they were justified, but from my experience, they do shut down a large number of decks on their own. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 12:21, November 1, 2013 (UTC)


 * I'm still highly amused that Big Eye has been around for a good 2 years and nobody batted an eyelid at it until a few months ago. It's like Cold Wave or something all over again. --Gadjiltron (talk • contribs) 13:47, November 1, 2013 (UTC)
 * I'm surprised people are still talking about hitting Draco and Big Eye. Hell, most Ruler builds don't even run more than 1 because it's hard for them to make rank 7's without their babies. In fact, almost 90% of the ruler builds that topped thus far this format preferred to go into the lv 8 synchros over the rank 7 exceeds (Stardust Radiance, Jeweled Red Dragon, Thought Ruler, Crimson Blader, Scrap Dragon, and Colossal Fighter), simply because it's so much easier to make them by searching Corseca or Flamvell Guard by banishing Blaster or Tempest. And there's no way Konami would hit all of the synchros or exceeds the rulers summon because they're always going to find a way to abuse something. Tempest, Redox, Blaster, and Tidal MUST be hit in January, if they aren't then they will keep ruining this game. They might as well ban the win-buttons while they're at it (Return and Sixth Sense). But the babies won't return unless the daddies get outright banned. I've seen some people want that to happen, but limiting them to 1 would be better for now, since that would seriously cut their consistency (if not kill it) as a pure deck while still keeping them alive as attribute support techs. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 16:30, November 1, 2013 (UTC)
 * While I understand your defense of Big Eye, the fact remains that it's not a hard card to get out (these days), and it does the same thing, but better (or worse, depending on how you think about it) as other forbidden cards (Brain control, change of heart) ~F.~ 12:03, November 2, 2013 (UTC)
 * Not necessarily, the fact is Big Eye isn't really so much of a problem card as he was viewed as, say, last format. Without their babies (Burner, Reactan, Lightning, and Stream), it's pretty hard for rulers to go into rank 7's now without using a lot of their resources. It's much easier to go into lv 8 synchros than rank 7 exceeds with rulers now. If you want to hit the deck, it would simply be far more logical to hit the 4 derp-broke dragons that will always find something to abuse instead of hit a bunch of monsters that can't be made consistently outside of those retarded dragons. Furthermore, Change of Heart and Brain Control can't really be compared to big eye because they're spell cards that take no setup or resources to use, making them much faster and easier to play in just about any deck. I think we can all agree that rulers themselves have to get stomped in January one way or another. Assuming that happens, there's no need to complain over the monsters they made so consistently. They also might as well ban the win-button traps (Return from the Different Dimension and Sixth Sense) while they're at it, just to be sure rulers don't ruin the game for another format. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 17:27, November 2, 2013 (UTC)

I don't now why macro cosmos is going to be banned, macro rabbit deck isn't very powerful, so macro comsmos isn't broken card.

Hey, I think your predirections are OK, but I think this sould be like this_

Banned:

Black Luster Soldier - Envoy of the Beginning Evigishki Mind Augus Dark Hole Limited:

Super Rejuvenation Fire King High Avatar Garunix Reasoning

Semi-Limited:

Number 16: Shock Master Compulsory Evacuation Device Tidal, Redox, Tempest, Blaster

No longer on list:

Magical Stone Excavation T.G. Striker
 * Macro Cosmos is broken not because of the decks it's mained against, but simply because so many decks like to use the graveyard nowadays and Macro Cosmos shuts them down. BLS doesn't have to get banned, but I'd be fine with it if Chaos Sorcerer came down to 2 or 3. Why should Mind Augus get banned? Gishki FTK is impossible with 1 Mind Augus, so why should it get banned? Super Rejuvenation could return so long as the babies stay banned. Fire Kings haven't done anything, Garunix doesn't need to be hit. No one uses Reasoning anymore so it has no need to go back on the banlist. Shock Master needs to be either at 3 or 0, because no one used more than 1. It seems hard to get out, but it does lock down entire decks on it's own. I don't want it unbanned. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 19:28, November 4, 2013 (UTC)

My Predictions
Forbidden

Mind Control - Steals an opponent's monster for synchro/xyz use, or you can just attack them directly if you take their only monster

Sixth Sense - Just call 5 or 6 and hope you get lucky...this card has good draw power and mill power so its a win/win in certain decks

Return from the Different Dimension - A win button in certain decks like Dragon Rulers

Eradicator Epidemic Virus - Its splashable in decks that run dark monsters with 2500 or more atk in their main deck and/or extra deck, Especially Dark World.

Dark Hole - They should just ban the final staple of the 3 (Heavy Storm and Monster Reborn are already banned)

Dandylion - Gets 2 tokens when its sent to the graveyard under any way, can be revived with Debris Dragon or Crane Crane (if you wanna make Meliae of the Trees) and be special summoned from the deck through Lonefire Blossom. and can be abused in the Shinra Archtype

Vanity's Emptiness - Just like Royal Oppression, except a weaker version thap prevents special summon

Limiter Removal - A win button for machine decks and its splashable in any machine deck

Foolish Burial - Alot of decks these days are graveyard related, not to mention the cards that triggers when sent to the graveyard like Dandylion, Archfiend Heiress, etc, and all the monsters that works in the graveyard like Destiny Hero - Malicious, etc.

Limited

The adult Dragon Rulers - Even with the babies banned, they are still too much

Mermail Abyssteus - Slow down Mermail/Atlanteans

Sinister Serpent - Too slow

Dark Magician of Chaos - If Dark Hole gets banned, there wouldnt be much of a point in keeping him banned (Just like Black Luster Soldier - Envoy of the Beginning)

Magician of Faith - Same as Dark Magician of Chaos. Also Flip effect monsters are too slow for the meta

Thousand-Eyes Restrict - Not as good as it used to be despite the fact it can be summoned through Instant Fusion (Which it will die at the end of the turn)

Skill Drain - Just like Soul Drain, this card should be hit again

Abyss-sphere - Another hit for mermails

Dragon Ravine - Basically sets up the graveyard for certain dragon decks like Dragon Rulers, Chaos Dragons, and the Dragon's Mirror spell card

Semi-Limited

Gladiator Beast Bestiari - Gladiator Beast arent doing anything

Neo-Spacian Grand Mole - No one uses this card, not to mention he is kind of slow

Reinforcements of the Army - Warrior decks havent been doing much in the meta

Unlimited

Plaguespreader Zombie - no one wouldnt really run more than 2

T.G. Striker - T.G.s need a boost

Magical Stone Excavation - If Dark Hole gets banned, basically all the good generic spell cards will be gone and there would not be any use in keeping this on the list (not as if anyone uses this anyways)Guardian Skunk (talk • contribs) 20:36, November 4, 2013 (UTC)
 * I'm not sure about Dandylion, it's a pretty decent card, but I'm not sure if the easy tokens would be reason enough to ban it. Foolish is a pretty generic way of setting up the grave, it could get banned but it's not a must. Machine Decks aren't doing anything right now, there's no need to ban Limiter Removal. Vanity's Emptiness and Skill Drain, well...if Macro, Fissure, and Soul Drain got hit to 1, they might as well hit those cards or other "you can't play" continuous traps like Iron Wall, Mind Drain, or the Shadow/Light-Imprisoning Mirrors. Wouldn't at all surprise me. Abyssteus and Abyss-Sphere, they could get hit like the OCG did, but only if they bring Diva or Dragoons down from 1. Having Teus, Sphere, Dragoons, and Diva all at 1 makes Mermails completely unplayable. If the daddies go to 1, you might not really need to hit ravine, and if you do, you'd have to ban it since Terraforming will just search it if it's at 1. I have no particular comments on the other options. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 22:32, November 4, 2013 (UTC)


 * Mind Control doesn't let the monster attack. Leaving it at 1 is fine. Others, no comments.--Perfect Sige (talk • contribs) 20:25, November 26, 2013 (UTC)

My predictions
Forbidden Super Rejuvenation: REALLY Overpowered. It should stay banned.

Limited Elemental HERO Stratos: More harder to summon Elemental HERO Great Tornado, and doesn't feel the same using Elemental HERO Avian.

Gateway of the Six: Pretty overpowered, but gives a helpful advantage if your in a tight spot.

Monster Reborn: This is a personal favorite. Really helpful in some situations. (What was Konami thinking?)

The baby Dragon Rulers: Some look cute, but the effects are overpowered, but it may bring back support for the Dragon Rulers.

Pot of Avarice: Just a really good way to reload your deck.

Number 11: Big Eye: Overpowered effect. Should restrict to 1 copy.

Trishula, Dragon of the Ice Barrier: Good effect, but it's almost worthless after it's effect activates.

Ultimate Offering: Really good staple card.

Ally of Justice Catastor: Really destructive effect.

IrregularVile (talk • contribs) 23:02, November 4, 2013 (UTC)
 * I'd prefer that Gateway and the baby DRs DON'T comeback. DR and Six Samurai are already overpowered. Reborn was good but annoying if used by the opponent. Avarice is great with Lightsworn. Trishula could come back. Offering, why were you banned? Catastor...is Catastor. NovaTsukimori (talk • contribs) 23:52, November 4, 2013 (UTC)
 * With Monster Reborn, Konami must have been thinking the same thing as Pot of Greed. A free, mindless +1 that every deck uses isn't good for the game. Rulers are already broken enough, hell they need to be hit more since they're still ruining this game, the daddies need to go to 1. Avarice was replaced by Duplicity so it probably won't come back. Big Eye...eh, he's not as easily made without the baby dragon rulers, no need to hit him. Offering does nothing but encourage swarm OTK's in Madolches and Gadgets, it should stay banned. I personally want Trishula back, but it's effect is way too powerful for it to realistically happen. The OCG shouldn't have unbanned it. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 07:58, November 5, 2013 (UTC)


 * How is reborn a +1? You give up Reborn for a Monster that's already been killed, so it doesn't really affect the +/- calculations. Reborn can lead to pluses, but that's about it. -- Dark Ace SP ( Talk ) 15:47, November 10, 2013 (UTC)


 * Pretty much, but point being, a completely one-sided card that gives you game-winning advantage for no reason should not be legal for the game. I'm surprised Reborn ever came back, let alone why wasn't it banned sooner? Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 21:15, November 10, 2013 (UTC)

Moja619's predictions
Forbidden Sixth Sense: i think this one's obvious

Limited

all 8 Dragon Rulers: The seniors definatley need to be hit, but if Konami doesn't want to ban them, then the next best thing is to limit them. Also, the juniors can be limited too, they would only have just one target, and it's a 50/50 chance that target is searched out before they do

Sinister Serpent: i still think it's worth experimenting at 1

Gateway of the Six: I don't think gateway needed the ban

Super Rejuvenation: since the D-rulers will certainly get hit again, i think this card can come back

Ultimate Offering: this card at 1 won't push decks like gadgets to top tier

Abysslinde/Abyssteus/Abyss-sphere: one of these definately needs to be hit

Semi-Limited

Genex Ally Birdman: ok, birdman with Divine Wind of Mist Valley is pretty powerful but Mist Valley decks are not topping, plus the Harpie Dancer FTK is currently not possible in the TCG

Scapegoat: three scapegoats is a lot of token abuse

Chaos Sorcerer: not as powerful as BLS

Thunder King Rai-Oh: it's an anti-meta card, but on the other hand, with the release of Mistake, I guess this card would not be needed

Black Whirlwind: maybe 3 of these made Blackwings a bit too powerful?

Brotherhood of the Fire Fist - Spirit: dragon rulers aside, fire fists aren't doing as well as i thought, and the 3-axis build is not being played as much as the 4-axis build

Infestation Pandemic: if Konami wants to hit Evilswarms, they should hit this

Unlimited

Tour Guide From the Underworld: i still think she can come off the list, with Sangan banned

Magical Stone Excavation: nearly noone uses this card

Deep-Sea Diva: if abysslinde/abyssteus/abyss-sphere get limited, then Diva can come off the list

Advanced Ritual Art: like Excavation, noone uses this card

--Moja619 (talk • contribs) 03:33, November 11, 2013 (UTC)
 * Harpie FTK isn't playable with 1 Birdman, let alone 2 Birdman, so I don't see why Birdman can't be at 2, but not 3 because then the FTK is playable again. In my opinion, Spirit and Rooster need to switch places, like the OCG did. Mermails are fine the way they are right now and they don't really need another consistency check; Mermails are actually the top deck in the OCG and they need to reconsider their ideas to hit the deck over in Japan. Chaos Sorcerer can come down to 2 or even 3 if you ban BLS. Black Whirlwind and Scapegoat could get hit to 2, but Scapegoat doesn't see much play to be honest, and Blackwings haven't done as much as their hype otherwise suggested. Everything else is fine. Oh and you also forgot to put Reasoning to 3 and Bestiari to 2. :P Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 12:54, November 11, 2013 (UTC)


 * Truth be told, the hit in the TCG actually stopped 3-Axis. Without all the Spirits to reuse Rooster, the deck isn't that bad, and the only way for them to use Spirit again is to go into Lion Emperor. -- Dark Ace SP ( Talk ) 13:12, November 13, 2013 (UTC)
 * Rekindling is also a thing to reuse Spirit and Leopard (but not Rooster since his def is 100), but even in the OCG 3-axis Fire Fists aren't too overpowered and don't win tournaments as much as Mermails and Rulers do. Limiting Rooster to 1 and Tenki to 2 keeps 3-axis alive but not broken, but limiting Spirit to 1 killed the deck. It's nearly impossible to play 3-axis with 1 Spirit, and the deck wasn't broken enough to deserve that. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 18:13, November 13, 2013 (UTC)


 * Maybe, but 1 Rooster had a miniscule effect on the deck, and I should know as I ran a version with only 1 Rooster. To compensate, I ran more Tensu, so my opening move (which was consistently pulled off), was to play Leopard, get Tenki, play Tensu, play Spirit then make Prince, and then end with a Rooster, and just do all that again next turn. Really wasn't hard to do. Also, Rekindling is another story altogether. -- Dark Ace SP ( Talk ) 18:10, November 16, 2013 (UTC)

Well, in the OCG where Rooster's at 1 and Tenki's at 2, the deck is still fairly decent, but it's not too broken, the top decks over there are Mermails and Rulers, both of which should get hit in February for the OCG. If not then Spirit should've gone to 2 first instead of 1, 3-axis Fire Fists are a good deck but they're not broken enough to deserve a limit on their main synchro/xyz card. I mean, if you Veiler that 1 Spirit, the deck already collapses. While Rekindling is more of a story for Lavals and Flamvells than Fire Kings and Fire Fists, it's still used in those other decks and probably should get hit. They need new support; in my opinion Konami needs to design a nerfed version of Rekindling that can only bring back 2 monsters with 200 def and not as many as possible, so they can still do decent synchro plays and not have a 3-card Quasar combo turn 1. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 18:32, November 16, 2013 (UTC)

KennethScarsPredicitons Forbidden: Sixth Sense-Gives certain decks draw power/mill power that doesnt minus them at all, just gives a +1-5 Return from the different Dimension- It's a win condition card that offers no distinct cost Thunder king rai-oh: since mistake is a card, konami will do what the did to avarice since the release of dichotomy, and ban TK

Between 0-1: number 11: big eye & Spellbook of fate Big eye has an effect that steals monsters for no distinct cost. it has an effect that all banned cards have via goyo guardian snatch steal brain control fate is just like trish, it has 3 parts in its effect that you can easily use, you can reuse fate as many times as you like, plus its at 3, and it doesnt target

limited: Dragon rulers. They have been very unhealthy in the game of yugioh, and need to be crushed now, while still doing what they were meant to do: help support its attributed decks. for the card to come back for a format, i say pot of greed. just for a format

between 1-2: Dracossack. there are still alot of decks that utilise this card, and it can be really devistating. but not too broken.

semilimited: gladiator beast bestiari. If heavy is gone, and mermails have a mst monster at 3, also lightsworns, then why limit besti? Blackwing gale & blackwhirlwind. That way it would be fair, plus double whirlwind is just as good as triple, just a little slow. 2 or three: one day of peace. Nuff said.

Unlimit: Baby dragons. With one big dragon, the baby dragons would be much more viable. And not broken


 * I don't even think Mistake is a more balanced version of T-King to begin with, if anything T-King should come down to 2 or 3 as being on a body isn't as powerful as being on a continuous trap card. As for Rulers...in all honesty I just want them to go away for good, so long as next format isn't another format dominated by Rulers I could care less about what happens with anything else. And Big Eye and Dracossack don't need to get hit if you limit or ban the daddy dragon rulers. I agree on Bestiari coming down to 2 and One Day to a certain extent. As much as it would help everyone, pot of greed is not ever coming back, staples like that are better off not being in the game. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 23:19, November 17, 2013 (UTC)

PREDICTIONS FOR 2014
I created an account here just to post here. so here's what i got. Not a "Super Player" here- have been to local tournaments and such, so some of my cards may differ. Some of these cards are older, as I've been playing for a while, and they should have been on here a while ago.

Things to note:

Sixth Sense will not be banned. The possibility of you discarding all the cards needed for a play is too high, and this card is just hyped. This card will have a similar fate to Dangerous Machine TYPE-6. In reality, it sounds like a good card, and some decks may run it (yes, I've seen people run it). But, many players don't want to risk loosing the match cause they're power play cards get discarded. With the Gravekeeper archetype cropping up again, Necrovalley will make this card see little play outside the side deck.

FORBIDDEN

Morphing Jar - They're pushing for the Ghostrick archetype and such. this card needs to be banned. Too many ways to reset this card.

Macro Cosmos - Grave Reliant decks this format. This kills a lot of types. Plus with gravekeeper's making a comeback.

Dark Hole obvious why

Legendary Six Samurai - Shi En - PLEASE BAN THIS ALREADY. Not because i run gravekeeper's, but this card i just overpowered

Limited

Magical Mallet - Not used as much, but gives complete hand advantage. It's ability to add any number of cards back to the deck, and draw new ones is pretty broken.

Future Fusion - Ok, i know what you're all thinking here. Why on earth would you ever want this back? Well, firstly, it can easily be destroyed/negated with backrow, it'll help push the new Cyber and Gladiator Beast support. Seeing as not a lot of decks this format address banished cards, we can test the waters at 1.

Vylon Disigma - Generic 3 LV. 4 XYZ monster, takes any opponents monster, has the same effect as Ally of Justice Catastor, but with changing types. never see anyone run more than one anyways

Number 66: Master Key Beetle - too many devastating uses for this card. Evilswarms for example.

Swarm of Scarabs - because we need a Night Assailant wannabe that can reset itself.

Semi-Limited

Gravekeeper's Stele - Obvious why.

Allure of Darkness - Think it would be ok at two

Junk Warrior - Tanukit's. seriously, when you can get 5000+ monster out on the field turn 2, pretty good.

Junk Synchron - while were at it.

Ghostrick Alucard - nobody i know who plays this runs more than two

Swords of Concealing Light - lets hit ghosticks some more

Gorz the Emissary of Darkness - not really that great now. Tragoedia at 2, this card should follow

UNLIMITED

Book of moon - not as good as other cards Book of Eclipse, Swords of Concealing Light, Tsukuyomi, etc...

Saleuthe (talk • contribs) 02:15, November 22, 2013 (UTC)
 * Sorry that you needed to make an account to edit the wiki, but I asked that question here. It was answered why you need accounts to edit wikia from now on.


 * Anyways, some of these don't make any sense. Why should Ghostricks be hit? They're a harmless archetype of monsters that have literally done nothing to deserve to get hit. And it seems contradictory that you would bring book of moon down to 3 if you want Alucard and Concealing Light to get hit. Junk Doppel is the same, T.G. Hyper Librarian and Formula Synchron are already at 1, there's no need to hit anything else in that deck. Master Key Beetle and Vylon Disigma getting limited makes no sense as all decks that run them only run 1, just like Shock Master. Magical Mallet and Swarm of Scarabs don't see much play, there's no point in hitting those cards. Six Samurais already lost Gateway of the Six, why should they have to lose Shi-En? That kills the deck. Future Fusion won't come back as long as dragon-based decks can abuse it with Five-Headed Dragon (Dragon Rulers anyone?) As for Sixth Sense...yes it will get banned, Konami only kept it at 1 this format because they wanted money from Joey's World, not to mention the TCG never got to use it before. Getting to draw 5 or 6 cards off a lucky dice roll is not only downright stupid, but the downside of Sixth Sense is good as well, if you want to set up your graveyard.


 * Sorry if I was being rude, but your predictions won't fix the problems in the current meta. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 03:41, November 22, 2013 (UTC)

98's updated predictions
Now that we have a month or so until the new list comes out, here's my revised thoughts on what should happen in the January banlist:

Banned:


 * Red-Eyes Darkness Metal Dragon - Well, maybe not, but if you insist on hitting the OTK aspect of pure Dragunities and Hieratics do this. It's not like they need this card to live anyways.
 * Dark Hole - I'd like to try out a format without any of the big three.
 * Return from the Different Dimension - A win-button.
 * Sixth Sense - No need to explain this.

Limited:


 * Blaster, Redox, Tempest, and Tidal - Rulers have utterly ruined this format and need to go away. This would make sure they don't dominate next format.
 * Brotherhood of the Fire Fist - Rooster - This is a somewhat biased choice of mine, but I like how the OCG handled 3-axis Fire Fists. Switch places with Spirit.
 * Dark Magician of Chaos - With the holy trinity of spells banned, this can come back to 1.
 * Magician of Faith - If Dark Magician of Chaos comes back, so should Faith. Flip effects are too slow anyways.
 * Sinister Serpent - I'd really like to test this card at 1. I doubt it would do anything anyways.
 * Thousand-Eyes Restrict - Another card I'd like tested at 1. Instant Fusioning this is nothing more than Soul Taker backwards, and Metamorphosis will not come back.
 * Wind-Up Carrier Zenmaity - Another biased choice of mine, but truth is, Zenmaity might not be that bad at 1, so long as Avarice and Shock Master don't come back.

Semi-Limited:


 * Dark Armed Dragon - I'd like this at 2 as a trade-off for 0 REDMD in chaos dragons, though it might be a little risky.
 * Dewloren, Tiger King of the Ice Barrier - The only relevant deck that can make this is Mermails, and with 1 Diva and 1 Dragoons, they can't even make more than 1 Dewloren, it was fine at 2.
 * Gladiator Beast Bestiari - Gladiator Beasts aren't doing anything, even in the OCG where they already bumped this to 2.
 * Neo-Spacian Grand Mole - Most decks don't use this card anymore. And like Bestiari, it's still not doing anything in the OCG, where it's also at 2.
 * Reinforcement of the Army - So long as Stratos and Gateway don't come back, warrior decks in general wouldn't be a problem with this at 2.
 * Rekindling - I know, Lavals hardly do anything, but this mega-Reborn can't go unpunished forever. Still, limiting or banning it would hurt them too much, thus, it needs a semi for now to cut a little consistency.

Unlimited:


 * Brotherhood of the Fire Fist - Spirit - Switch places with Rooster. Also, if 4-axis can have 3 Wolfbarks, I don't see why 3-axis can't have 3 Spirits.
 * Tour Guide from the Underworld - Not many people use it anymore, and with Sangan gone, she can probably come off the list.
 * Advanced Ritual Art - Was unlimited in the OCG, Ritual decks still don't do anything over in Japan, the TCG should do it too.
 * Gold Sarcophagus - The hit to this was a mistake. It should've stayed at 3, and has no business being at 1 whatsoever if the Rulers go to 1.
 * Magical Stone Excavation - Just unlimit it already. No one runs it.
 * Reasoning - Was unlimited in the OCG, still hasn't seen play, the TCG should do it too.
 * Dimensional Prison - No one used more than two of these, if at all.
 * Mirror Force - Like Advanced Ritual Art and Reasoning, the OCG did it, it still hasn't seen play, the TCG needs to do it too.

These are my final thoughts for January. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 06:55, November 26, 2013 (UTC)

'This is my predictions for the Jan 2014 Ban list, Never predicted before, but lets see if I get this right:''

Forbidden: 1-Return from the D.D. Instant Win for Dragons.

2-Sixth Sense: I tried to convince myself that it should stay at one, but I cannot avoid the fact that its a 2+ all the way. It's not just a dice roll.

Limited: 1-Royal Decree, the same reason they hit Macro

2-Shock Master, No idea why banned when it was at 3!

3-Gateway of the Six: Why did they ban it? Cuz people cried for it? Wind-up Factory is still out their.

4-Dimension Fusion: Return is MORE BROKEN! You can use Return no matter how much life points you have, but Fusion: You need them LP+it works on both players.

5-Solemn Judgment: Just one of Konami mistakes to ban.

6-Stratos: Another Konami mistake.

7-Pot of Dichotomy It's as good as Avarice in a way.

8-Dark Magician of Chaos

9-Abysslinde/Abyssteus/Abyss-sphere: One of these is enough, mermails were never hit, and I think it's fair that they should get hit.

10-Mistake: Its a TK, so Konami has to do something with this, givin that it doesn't need to be SUMMONED. Just set and play.

11-Ultimate Offering: It's great, but not great enough to get banned. You might use it once or twice given the reason that it's costy.

12-Super Rejuvination: If Dragons get hit.

13-If by any reason Konami decides to hit dragons to one, the Babies have to come back for sure.

Semi: 1-Black Whirlwind: So they ban Gateway and suddenly remove whirlwind form list....100% injustice.

2-Rescue Rabbit. Enough said.

3-Macro Cosmos

4-Pot of Dichotomy It's as good as Avarice in a way.

5-Dragon's Ravine "if not limited" It's a hacking tool...

6-Birdman. Limiting it was just wrong. Now no one uses it, and I mean no one.

7-If E-Dragons would get hit, they would go here. putting them at one means stop playing them at all.

8-If Dragons stay untouched, which I slightly think so, Sacred swords have to go here.

9-Gold Sarc: Again, if Dragons get hit, no reason to keep it at one.

No longer in list:

One day of peace. It's a great staler, but not a reason to limit.

Dracossack and Big Eye will not get banned, no matter what happens to dragons.

I really want Trishula to come back to 1, but I already know that it won't.

That's all I can think of. Max.312 (talk • contribs) 09:16, November 26, 2013 (UTC)
 * Mermails weren't hit? Last I checked, Diva and Dragoons went to 1, they lost consistency with that. Dimension Fusion is never coming back, it has too many broken plays and 2000 LP is totally worth it if you get to summon several monsters to the field to OTK. Imagine Rulers with that card...The others I'm not sure about, but if Decree went to 1, we could be looking at a set 5 pass format, Decree is fine at 3. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 14:06, November 26, 2013 (UTC)


 * @Max.312 - Pot of Dichotomy isn't nearly as broken as Avarice. First off, you can only use it at the start of your main phase 1, which means you can't Synchro Summon a bunch of monsters then use it, and it also stops you from attacking. The card is more balanced that Avarice. With TK, you could also use it to negate Special Summons.
 * I'm a bit mixed about Ravine, I'm not entirely sure that Ravine should be hit when all it did was set up Rulers, Rulers we all think will be restricted next format. One Day isn't part of the Gishki Draw FTK, but Exodia isn't really the most fun deck to play, plus One Day would get play in quite a few decks besides Exodia. Gateway is not a Factory, because Gateway can be used multiple times in one turn. If Factory is at three, no reason Whirlwind can't be too.
 * As for Stratos, I think his card design is just bad. You get to search every time he's summoned, so Call of the Haunted, Pinpoint Guard, and a even Redox all make him trigger his effect. Not to mention while he was around, there were like 3-4 other cards that had to stay on the list too. If we want a shorter and more effective list, Stratos had to go.

-- Dark Ace SP ( Talk ) 15:36, November 26, 2013 (UTC) -- 1)Okay, when I said Mermails were never hit, I meant that Diva wasn't a loss going to 1. The deck plays as good as it was "too good" so cutting down one of the above mentioned mermails just seems fair. 2)For Dimension Fusion, I mentioned that because Return is way more broken than it. But Dragons can benefit from both, so I'll agree with you that it should stay banned as well. 3)Dichotomy: You have to think of all possible scenarios where this is used, for example: Dark Gaia OTK. One reason it was badly damaged was the ban of avarice. Dichotomy is more broken since it only makes you choose 3 cards. In case you don't know, Dark Gaia has many types of monsters: Rock, fiend, machine, and some others. 4)Stratos is only used in bubble beat, and after it leaving, it left a huge gap that made even me stop playing them. I still didn't take off my stratos from the deck cuz I know it will come back for sure. Max.312 (talk • contribs) 17:23, November 26, 2013 (UTC)
 * Mermails haven't really done anything this format with the generic searchers limited to 1, they still have some plays but Diva and Dragoons to 1 was a big cut on their consistency. They're a solid deck but not incredibly overpowered like Rulers. How is Dichotomy more broken than Avarice if it only lets you recycle 3 monsters that must have different types when Avarice lets you choose 5, regardless of type, and not skip your battle phase? That's what makes Dichotomy more balanced than Avarice if anything. HERO's and Six Sams would be better off getting a 2nd ROTA to search than get Stratos and Gateway back, and as for HERO's, the Neos Alius beat is a thing as well as Bubble Beat. Also, Stratos kept D-HERO Malicious, Pot of Duality, A Hero Lives and E-Call on the list just so he could stay at 1, and if that one card keeps four other cards on the list just so it can stay, it's obviously very overpowered, and to make the list smaller and better, Stratos had to go. Ninety-eight (talk • contribs) 17:55, November 26, 2013 (UTC)